• Mulligrubs@lemmy.world
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        24 hours ago

        Did you know she was speaker of the house? That’s, like, a big deal.

        It doesn’t matter what random Democrats think (obviously), it matters what the leadership thinks.

        • HalfSalesman@lemmy.world
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          3 hours ago

          This is almost repeating the argument that is literally what the OP is getting at.

          The point is democrats and republicans are not the fucking same and people who say they are are not serious people or worth serious consideration.

          • Matty Roses@lemmy.today
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            2 hours ago

            So, to repeat the question, do you think the Democratic Party, of which Pelosi is a leader and not even the most right wing one, opposes the neoliberal order?

      • Space_Cowboy92@lemmy.world
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        1 day ago

        Democrats and liberals by definition are pro capitalism. Stop conflating leftists and liberals. Leftism begins at anti capitalism.

        • MrGeneric@lemmy.today
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          24 hours ago

          Liberalism historically from its inception has believed people have certain rights, right to “free market “ as they say is one of those. In the US Democrats also go by liberal, but not all liberals and democrats know their position is definitionally pro capitalism and liberal has taken on a definition of left of conservatives/republicans that most Americans have not dug in that far.

          TLDR To speak American politics their are conservatives/Republicans and everyone else is liberal, including in that camp progressives, leftists, Bernie Bros, anarchists. To speak Leftist politics, you have Leftists, Anarchists, Liberals (including conservatives, liberals, progressives because all their policies are pro capitalism )

        • HalfSalesman@lemmy.world
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          1 day ago

          Democrats are a political party, one that hasn’t had a consistent ideological set of beliefs throughout its own existence. For that matter neither has the republican party.

          They are not “by definition” pro capitalism.

          • Mulligrubs@lemmy.world
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            24 hours ago

            Well, they’ve always been capitalist. There’s never been a time when they weren’t capitalist. So… odd argument to make.

            • HalfSalesman@lemmy.world
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              3 hours ago

              You and @Space_Cowboy92 don’t seem to have the best reading comprehension.

              I was refuting that democrats are “by definition” pro capitalist. Not whether the party leadership always had an explicit pro capitalist agenda. Those are different things.

              Now, I did say their ideology has changed, which is also true. I said that to support my argument, but it was not the point I was making in of itself.

              Weaseling in a word that indicates an immutable and intrinsic trait to something that is not immutable in that way and then subtly backpedaling to a different stance is slimy.

              • Matty Roses@lemmy.today
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                2 hours ago

                Yes, in theory, if we remove all the current leadership, the Democrats could not be capitalist.

                And, given how US election law is written, which has carve outs for the Dems all over the place to avoid 3rd parties, that is what is needed.

                But the Democrats as they now and in all times past have been are capitalist.

          • Space_Cowboy92@lemmy.world
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            1 day ago

            They 1000% are pro capitalism in the United States. You’re eithe fucking stupid, or not a citizen of the USA to think democrats are not pro capitalism.