punkisundead [they/them]

Even if reading comprehension would be a mayor factor in this discussion, I want to be able to write out my thoughts in a way that is easily understood by different levels of reading comprehension. I think its also about context awareness which I sometimes struggle with. And also going the extra mile of writing out disclaimers so there is not such a response based on assumptions.

and I do so love (/s) how often the people who are supposed to be on my side will use misogynistic/homophobic/transphobic language to do so

Yeah I feel like people are not really great at seeing how this can hurt their own comrades and those groups whoe they want to support as well.

Thanks you for your feedback. I appreciate it. While I personally wouldn’t read it exactly that way, it seems like a pretty big amount of people do.

But I would like to say that your comment is not really a reply to my comment. I replied to someone stating:

Yes. Your whole concept is that if you do something the fascists do then you’re the same thing.

While you argued that my comment has to be read as that:

This cannot mean anything other than you think antifa and nazis wear masks for the same reason.

Those things are not the same, because the being the “same thing” and to “wear masks for the same reason” are pretty different from each other IMO. But I think somehow many people read those things as being basically the same. Would you also see it as pretty much the same?

Everything what you wrote is just based on this assumption:

Your whole concept is that if you do something the fascists do then you’re the same thing.

Which is just not true. But maybe that misunderstanding highlights where I could work on my phrasing.

Wow what a classist thing to say.

You are just wrong here. Being able see fascists motivations, understanding their reasoning and figuring out their strategies is one of the keys to defeat them. And you don’t have to treat them differently just because you are able to make sense out of their behavior, because why should you?

Yeah I think this very much fits my experience, also with the way people call themselves

Sorry but I doubt anyone knowing the word pusilanimous would actively decide to use the easily misunderstood short form.

Yeah reading with that in mind I can see that. Thanks for that feedback.

Thank you for trying to explain your viewpoint. Based on that I can understand where you are coming from even if I disagree.

Most antifa don’t even hide their faces

I feel that this might vary region by region. Atleast in my experience in my part of the world most try to obscure their faces.

Members of the group in the picture (patriotic front) just recently got doxxed which resulted in them losing jobs, atleast thats what the press reports. Which is good btw and I find it good.

I am not saying this to make them look good or give them sympathy, but for them its also more then just social consequences and also a matter of safety. And yes its not in the same level as is for antifascists & anarchists, I know that.

Seems like we dont really come to any conclusion here, because I dont really see the hypocrisy in that. Like genuinely. Might be because I mask up for protests/actions I attend and I never feel hypocritic about that. Like I feel I still fully stand behind my opinions and ideals and thats why I have a real hard time imagining how that would apply to others.

Besides, why use sexist language like pussy? In my experience its mostly used to shame people for not adhering to a toxic masculine ideal, which is something we should get past IMO

Nah, they don’t do the same things.

Yes they dont do the same things.

But I wrote: thing. Whitout “s”. So my comment was just focused on the act of masking up as a way to stop consequences of their action.

Did I write my comment in a way that made it seem like I thought antifascists do the same thingS as nazis? Because if so, please tell me how I can improve my phrasing so that I dont get 10 angry antifascists in my replies that seem to think that is what I actually mean or communicate.

Yes I totally see that difference and I feel nothing what I wrote indicates that I dont.

What I dont get is, how people come to the conclusion that I dont see the difference. Like is it my phrasing or the context of this specific discussion?

Clever to tell a visibly queer person (check my pronouns), active on an leftwing instance which is moderating explicitly antifascist communities, that they dont see the difference. Must be feel good to mark me as an

an enemy of society

or call me something ableist.

Btw I usually enjoy being called an enemy of society, but only when its done by conservatives

Yeah for sure all of that. I agree with every word you say and I think you also phrased it beautifully.

I still dont really get the backlash against pointing out that nazis wearing masks is actually pretty reasonable from their perspective and not really a sign of weakness (weakness isnt even a bad thing yo) or hypocrisy.

My flippant reaction was just based on the replies that tried to point out supposedly false equivalence when none of my comments stated that I viewed fascists and antifascists even remotely in the same category of morally good or bad.

Sorry, but is that really what you get from my comments in this chain of comments? That this is my point? Because then I really need to work on my way of phrasing things…

Antifascists mask up so they don’t get doxxed or targeted by fascists.

Nazis literally do the same thing, just the words “Antifascists” and “fascists”.

Also the second talking point is thrown around by liberals, conservatives and in my country also some communists when people talk about masking up. I believe the act of masking up usually does not impact the idea one does stand for, so antifascists, activists and anarchists who mask up are just as legit as those that dont. And Nazis that dont wear mask are as shitty as those that wear a mask

So you mean both use it to hide from their enemies?

Come on this argument sucks. Antifascists also cover their faces and it doesnt take anything away from them [aka antifascists].

And they [aka white supremacists] want to scare, do crimes & violence and want to get away with it. Wearing masks is actually the best way to show that you plan on doing exactly that. It 100% fits what they aka white supremacists] want to achieve.

Edit: Well the replies showed me that I missed the social cue for “I just want to hate on nazis here, not have a discussion about narratives that one might reproduce when doing so”. Fair. Also remember to support your local Antifa / antifascists.

& clarified pronouns because of feedback